Our report from a few days ago was accurate with one exception. As the California EPA indicated, Harley has now confirmed the new Milwaukee-Eight 114 and 107 engines for 2017. These engines in fact have four-valve heads, not two-valve heads, as previously reported.
The new heads also offer a higher compression ratio and improved heat management. The redesign of these engines is entirely from the “ground up” with all-new parts. The following press-release and video at the bottom of this article provide all the details. This is very big news for Harley-Davidson.
MILWAUKEE (August 23, 2016) – The all-new Harley-Davidson® Milwaukee-Eight™ engine, ninth in the lineage of the company’s iconic Big Twin engines, delivers more power and an improved motorcycling experience for riders and passengers while retaining the iconic look, sound and feel of its predecessors. An all-new design, the Milwaukee-Eight engine offers quicker throttle response, more passing power, purer sound, a smoother ride and more of the feeling riders want from a Harley-Davidson Touring motorcycle engine.
“The guiding principle behind the Milwaukee-Eight engine was our voice of customer research from every region of the world,” said Scott Miller, Harley-Davidson Vice-President of Styling and Product Development Strategy. “Riders asked us to create a new engine designed to enhance their motorcycle touring experience in every way. Those same voices also demanded that we stay true to our legacy and respect the defining elements of a Harley-Davidson V-Twin. It was a big challenge, but one we’ve met. With the Milwaukee-Eight, a new era of Harley-Davidson power, performance and innovation has been forged.”
New Milwaukee-Eight engines will power every 2017 Harley-Davidson Touring and Trike motorcycle model. Milwaukee-Eight engines will be offered in two displacements and three variations:
Milwaukee-Eight 107 (107 CID, 1750cc) featuring precision oil-cooled cylinder heads for the Street Glide®/Street Glide® Special, Road Glide®/Road Glide Special®, Electra Glide® Ultra Classic®, Road King® and Freewheeler® models.
Twin-Cooled™ Milwaukee-Eight 107 (107 CID, 1750cc) featuring liquid-cooled cylinder heads for the Ultra Limited/Ultra Limited Low, Road Glide® Ultra and Tri Glide® Ultra models.
Twin-Cooled Milwaukee-Eight 114 (114 CID,1870cc) featuring liquid-cooled cylinder heads for the CVO™ Limited and CVO™ Street Glide® models.
More Power
Each Milwaukee-Eight engine produces 10 percent more torque than the engine it replaces in Touring models. In addition to increased displacement, the Milwaukee-Eight engine features a higher compression ratio and four-valve cylinder heads with 50 percent more intake and exhaust flow capacity. The valve train requires no adjustment as the design of the rocker arms enables valve lash to be set at the factory for life. Dual spark plugs for each cylinder contribute to more-efficient combustion. A single chain-driven camshaft is lighter, mechanically less complex and creates less friction and noise.
“The Milwaukee-Eight engine retains the classic Harley-Davidson 45-degree V-Twin design,” said Alex Bozmoski, Harley-Davidson Chief Powertrain Engineer, who led the development team. “It also retains the power characteristic that is the real legacy of the Harley-Davidson Big Twin: strong low-end torque with a broad, flat power curve through the mid-range that’s ideal for the Touring motorcycle rider.”
Quicker Acceleration
The Milwaukee-Eight engine weighs the same as the engines it replaces, so all of its extra power contributes directly to improved acceleration performance.
- The Milwaukee-Eight 107 accelerates 11 percent quicker 0-60 mph, equal to a two to three bike length improvement, and 11 percent quicker from 60-80 mph in top gear, equal to a one to two bike length improvement, compared to the Twin Cam High Output 103.
- The Milwaukee-Eight 114 accelerates 8 percent quicker 0-60 and 12 percent quicker 60-80 than the Twin Cam 110™.
Heat Management
The Milwaukee-Eight engine offers improved rider and passenger thermal comfort due to reduced heat absorption, increased heat rejection and a redesigned exhaust system. Each Milwaukee-Eight engine features a precision cooling strategy based on the specific demands of the motorcycle model, using a targeted flow of either oil or liquid coolant around the hottest areas of the cylinder heads. A new knock sensor for each cylinder enables more-precise timing control. The rear exhaust pipe is re-positioned and the exhaust catalyst is relocated to move heat away from the passenger. Idle speed is lowered from 1,000 rpm to 850 rpm.
Improved Fit
A new, slimmer primary drive cover and the low-profile shape of the air cleaner cover provide improved rider legroom around the engine and an easier reach to the ground for many riders. All Milwaukee-Eight powered models are fitted with an Assist and Slip Clutch with improved hydraulic actuation that reduces clutch lever effort by 7 percent.
Reduced Vibration
The rubber-mounted Milwaukee-Eight engine features a single internal counter balancer that cancels 75 percent of primary vibration at idle for a more-refined feel and more-comfortable experience for rider and passengers while retaining the classic character of Harley® V-Twin engines.
Richer Exhaust Note
Lighter valves, a single camshaft, optimized cover designs and improved driveline components eliminate mechanical powertrain noise. The engine intake and air cleaner are designed to reduce intake sound while ensuring maximum air flow. As a result, the new Milwaukee-Eight engine is mechanically quieter, enabling a richer exhaust tone, and meets all global noise and emissions standards while allowing the unmistakable rumble of its exhaust note to resonate.
Improved Charging
The Milwaukee-Eight engine charging system delivers 50 percent more output to the battery at idle to better support the power demands of Touring riders, including accessory lighting, performance audio, and heated gear and other accessories.
New Engine Styling
The Milwaukee-Eight engine features sleek, modern styling that respects the heritage of previous Harley-Davidson Big Twin engines.
“The Milwaukee-Eight engine is styled to project power,” said Brad Richards, Harley-Davidson Director of Styling. “I compare it to the back of a swimmer, lean in the waist but broad and muscular in the shoulders.”
“The rocker covers look like skin stretched taut over muscle, like the rocker arms are about to burst out of the engine,” said Richards. “For the first time since the Knucklehead, the rocker covers reflect the action going on below. And they are massive. When you sit on the bike you can look down and see more of this engine.”
To experience the transformation of the 2017 Harley-Davidson® Touring models for yourself, visit h-d.com/demos to schedule a test ride.
See more of MD’s great photography:
Harley is succumbing to the pressure. Indian has stolen there thunder and with such small improvements this isn’t going to cut it. Other attempts at new bikes don’t work cause face it Harleys are about image nothing to do with comfort or performance. Just as stated above buy a Harley and ride with the pack or stay back with the asian garbage. Well I don’t belong in that pack so I ride bikes that are enjoyable. I like performance, reliability and minimal maintenance. I like manufactures that introduce new technologies and support there customers. I have never found any of that to be the case with Harley. I had a great ride in the stock market but now am shorting them like crazy. The writing is clearly on the wall so if you own one and want some of your investment back you should start thinking. The jink being turned out now days will never become that famous forties barn find. I see a Harley I see the 70’s and that is too bad since they are one on the only companies in the USA to get a handout from the government to avoid bankruptcy….
I’ll keep my BMW K16GT – it has 160 HP and out performs every other touring bike on the road.
The inline 6 is the smoothest motor BMW makes and I’m on #8
I own a BMW K1600 GTL. Great bike, but I’m considering trading it on a touring bike with a lower seat height as my wife is having both knees replaced, and it will be easier for her to mount a bike with a lower seat height.
For reference, the heavy bikes I have owned include a HD Softtail, a GL1800, A BMW K1200LT, a Victory Cross Country Tour, and now a BMW K1600. I’ve also taken four demo rides on Indian Roadmasters, including the new 2017 that has the glass dashboard.
A local Harley dealer was very accomodating, and rolled an Ultra Linited out the door for us to ride, with the request that we not ride more than 10 miles as this really isn’t a demo bike and they don’t want to run up the miles on it.
Here’s my impression:
Engine: It looks nice, and I’m not invested in how the engine should look compared with past HD engines. It vibrates at idle, but not as much as the 2015 RGU I rented last summer. The mirrors don’t blur. Some vibration can be felt in the bars, and it isn’t annoying. The vibrations decrease substantially, but do not disappear, at about 1800 rpm. At speed, it vibrates less than the Victory. Minimal vibrations were felt in the footboards, front and rear. There was enough heat on my lower right leg to be noticeable, but not enough to be uncomfortable. The heat was far less than on the Indian and the Victory. Ambient air temp was 88F.
The engine has a nice torque profile. It accelerates well without having to bang on the throttle. Shifting was smooth, with a noticeable, but not obnoxious, thunk as each gear was entered. Shift action was far better than it was on the 2015 RGU, and also on the Indian. Good clutch action, easy engagement, no stuttering. Firm clutch lever opertation. Running through 1-2-3-4 in semi-rural roads was delightful. This engine/transmission is superb at accomplishing its mission.
Suspension: The 2017 suspension is miles and miles better than on previous touring bikes. It’s really good. It is firm but comfortable. Well connected to the road, and it doesn’t telegraph every bump and pothole. I looked for a few manhole indentations and other road imperfections, and the bike took them comfortably. This was a big deal (for us) as our current BMW has a high-tech electrically adjustible suspension that we sometimes can’t make comfortable on long highway rides. The amout of dive when braking is substantially reduced, the rear did not bottom out. This is a much better suspension than the Victory and the Roadmaster, both of which use an air-adjustible rear set-up that is prone to hard bottoming. I’d still give the Cross Country Tour a slight edge in handling, though, because it took curves and corners better.
Brakes: Strong, nice feel. Very linear. I’m used to using the front brake only, and the linked brakes work very well. Good braking balance. The linking stops at speeds below 25mph, I believe, so making a sharp U-turn with the back brake engaged was simple.
Other: It sounds great. We usually wear earplugs when riding, but didn’t for this demo. The engine is quiet, except for a whirring sound, and the exhaust note was very nice. It sounded like a Harley should sound, and a little more basso than the 2015 RGU sounded. Air management is good, though I felt some helmet buffetting above 50 mph, and I’d swap in a slightly taller windshield. My wife felt no buffeting. She liked her accomodations better than on the Indian, which provided less fore-aft passenger space. Seats are comfortable, and everything else has the usual HD high quality look and feel. It’s a heavy bike, though, and weights a good 200 pounds more than my K1600. And each of those extra pounds is quite noticeable when maneuvering in stop-and go traffic.
I expect that we may buy an Ultra Limited next spring, depending on how my wife’s knees fare. This bike is the right tool for heading across the US, which is how we travel.
On a fluke I googled “Harley Davidson Forums”. Much to my amazement, I discovered a surprising fact. Believe it or not there are “a few” out there. I have included that google link for you. Now (every other day) when you’re not checking in here maybe you can find some tidbit of HD chit-chat at one of forums on this (admittedly) paltry list.
https://www.google.com/search?biw=800&bih=500&ei=WbXGV6HvJIGDmQHJ7bCIDQ&q=Harley+Davidson+Forums&oq=Harley+Davidson+Forums&gs_l=mobile-gws-serp.3..0i71k1l5.0.0.0.266993.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0….0…1c..64.mobile-gws-serp..0.0.0.RF_ux9va0Pc
What!!!! a Harley Article from “Motorcycle Every Other Daily” is on here. What blasphemy is this????
Guess you’re feeling pretty smug. Whatever gets you by. Kinda like the guy that’s invited to a party and then gets drunk and pukes on the host. The blasphemy is yours sir/madam. Congratulations.
On a fluke I googled “Harley Davidson Forums”. Much to my amazement, I discovered a surprising fact. Believe it or not there are “a few” out there. I have included that google link for you. Now (every other day) when you’re not checking in here maybe you can find some tidbit of HD chit-chat at one of forums on this (admittedly) paltry list.
https://www.google.com/search?biw=800&bih=500&ei=WbXGV6HvJIGDmQHJ7bCIDQ&q=Harley+Davidson+Forums&oq=Harley+Davidson+Forums&gs_l=mobile-gws-serp.3
I knew about the M8 when Motorcycle.com posted an April Fools article show how HD trademarked the name. Then Revzilla posted another article of the actual engine itself on a Tri-Glide.
Luckily there are many online sites that I can peruse through and get my fix. Cyrilhuzeblog, visordown, blog.motorcycle.com, etc etc. I used checked this site every morning to see a new article, but I noticed a trend or lack thereof postings. I still check it occasionally, but it seems gear toward to folks that are not the Harley type.
I like that new motor, a lot of folks crying about little stuff because they either are anti HD or so pro HD they are blind. Single unit construction ins’t perfect either and multiple lubrication points ins’t a killer. Congrats to HD on a 4 valve head
But in all seriousness, how does this engine compare to 1) the Yamaha Roadliner engine; 2) The Honda VTX 1800; the Suzuki M109 engine?
With regard to what?
How many of the “Harley experts” on this site have owned a Harley? Owned, not read about. And not the ” I know someone who owned a Harley.” Someone on here mentioned the the morons in Sturgis in another article. Article didn’t have anything to do with Harleys but it was brought up anyway. No shortage of hypocrites on here. Personally, I don’t care what brand a person rides. I love my ’13 FLHRC and if you don’t thats ok. Love my Honda too and theres plenty of Honda haters on here also.
I’ve had 6 but haven’t had one in 12 years now. If Harley will make a standard riding position sport tourer, I just might have number 7.
btw also had 11 Hondas, 9 Yamahas, 1 Kawasaki, 3 Suzuki’s, 1 Triumph and 1 BSA. Currently have 2 Hondas, a 1300cc Sport tourer my wife and I have put 76,000 miles on and an 1100 cc retro standard I’ve put 24,000. I use them, no garage queens in my stable.
If we’re talking numbers, I’ve also owned 6 Harleys. The most were Hondas at 23, 2 Suzukis, 2 Kawasakis and 1 Ducati. What is really hard is finding one bike to satisfy all my quirks. Each day is a desire for a different type. Have neither the garage space or most important, the money to own all I desire. But when I win the lottery, look out!
I owned a 1969 XLCH. I have also owned a number of Japanese sportbikes. I have never felt compelled to feel any one was better or worse than the next. I enjoyed all of them. I don’t hate Harleys. I would buy one again if they built the one I want. Just not holding my breath. But please (you know who you are) stop labeling me just because I don’t hold The Motor Company in the same sacred, high regard as do you. Criticism is not necessarily a sign of hatred. It also is not considered “expert” by any stretch of the imagination. In my case, it is a plea for the “iconic” American brand to give some thought to something (lighter weight, better handling, real performance) besides tradition and image. Build it and we will come.
I have a 2009 Harley Cross Bones, never had a problem with it.
I love the looks, rides very well at the legal speed limits, comfortable.
I doubt I will ever sell it, it’s everything “I” need in a motorcycle now that I am done doing track days (which I did on my cbr1000rr and triumph t595).
I road a 107 road glide today. It felt very nice. Very strong and not even broken in yet. And they also improved the suspension. It was very plush feeling.
I did not like the angle of the bars. But they only had two out for test rides.
I currently have a 2016 road king, I also put the stage V tire shredder kit in it. The bikes were pretty even as far as strength it seemed. The milwaukee 8 107 may have outperformed my 110. It’s close even at stock. I’m probably going to trade it in for a 2017. Because tell you the truth, the new motor puts to bed all the issues. They really did it right. This engine was due for this revamping. I’ll wait and see how much it’ll be (money is what it will boil down to). I’ve also had a yamaha raider and vstar 1300. Both were very good motorcycles. The raider power plant is still much more powerful and refined. It’s an excellent engine. I miss the raider power sometimes, but it should have abs and a 6th gear. It should. My road king handles and brakes better than the raider. My stage 5 kit is powerful though. I had to get it after coming off the 113ci and going to the 103ci.
Drive what you feel best on and what you can afford, and most of all enjoy the ride.
The following link:
http://forums.cycleworld.com/showthread.php?t=238581
is supplied to shed light on comments made by WSHart earlier. I certainly do NOT do this as a proponent or apologist of/for his viewpoint but to familiarize us all with the origin of his references.
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhh…”I certainly do NOT do this as a proponent or apologist of/his viewpoint”…
The Highwayman is all tongue-in-cheek, so what’s your excuse? Get your head out of your buttocks, kiddo.
Liberals. Hate America. Hate freedom. Hate themselves. FTN.
Feel better? Thanks for the “kiddo” label. I’m 67. As for the “liberal” label you’re partly right. Concerning the “Hate America. Hate freedom. Hate themselves”…I’ll just hope that’s another of your “tongue in cheek” remarks. In your defense, you and my wife are on the same page with the “head…buttocks” opinion. Although it’s taken her 33 years to come to that conclusion, you reached it much more quickly. While the “Highwayman” may be “tongue in cheek”, your usage of it certainly wasn’t and your (very popular lately) immediate segue into political pigeonholeing is a clear indication of your (not so subtle) feelings. “FTN”…misplaced anger/aggression? FYI, my comments are without hidden meaning or innuendo. In conclusion, apologies to all who are being subjected to this childish exchange. It has no place on this forum. My portion of it has ended.
Im sorry, that was hilarious. What a load of bull excrement. That may have been tongue in cheek, but there are many who actually buy into that drivel. I knew one Union carpenter that would not buy anything not made in America. Used to bow hunt with the fellow. One day he comes to the house riding a new Sportster and bragging on it’s American properties. I pointed out the Japanese instuments, carburator, forks and ignition parts. Made him so mad he tried to return it but the dealership wouldn’t take it back, so he sold it. Close minded he was. They are out there.
I was fortunate enough to ride a 2017 Road glide special today at my local dealer’s ,and I must say I was very impressed It handles quite well ,has very good acceleration very torquey very good brakes and quite smooth and by the way I have been riding for about 45 years and still ride dirt and do track day’s with my sport bikes so to all those haters out there (yes I have criticized Harley in the past) but it seems they are really making some radical improvements GO RIDE one.
Ok take the Road Glide Special, raise the seat height to 30-31″ with a nice flat dual saddle on it, lower the handlebars, bring the foot pegs back under your hips, trim the fairing some and put an adjustable taller windshield on it, make the bags so they dont look like an after thought and put a shock on the back that gives you maybe 5″ or so of suspension travel and we are getting close
Yeah, and take at least 200 pounds off it
funny, I was running up the highway on my Honda ST 1300 today ( 1300cc liquid cooled V4 sport tourer with fairing, bags, upright seating, mid pegs for those that don’t know)and while rolling along got to imagining/thinking, you know I could totally see this with one of the new targeted water cooling, counter balanced Harley motors in it and belt drive weighing about 600 pounds … why the heck don’t they do that? Geez you have to think something along those lines would be a great seller for Harley.
Yeaaaallll… rrightt. I see what you mean but 600 pounds is really optimistic.
The motor is too heavy. But I wonder the same thing. Or sport tourer with a v twin at 600 ish lbs. I think you have a better shot of that happening with Indian or Victory with the Scout engine.
Well even if it came out at the same weight as the ST at 717 pounds (which is really heavy) it would still be lighter than a full dressed Harley by a couple hundred pounds.
One can dream lol
To those like Randy from Ridgcrest: I just like to put around with the wife and go places safely, see the sights, slow and smelling the roses. I have no desire to hunker over with my feet behind me, my arse sticking up in the air, and my helmet banging on a fender that looks like Big Bird’s beak. Hope there’ll always be an HD Glide out there. We are not all Rodney Road Racer.
+1
And HD make’s how many models for doing just what you want? Just because I don’t want a 700-900 pound 20-25 degree lean angle cruiser I’m suddenly “Rodney Road Racer”? And since when did you mix up “standard” with “sport” ergonomics?
No kidding. Not asking them to change their entire 20 bike line up. Just make 1 additional model for those of us that would like to ride an American sport tourer without looking like a Sons of Anarchy wannabe. They can even use this motor if they want. Can’t believe it could possibly be that difficult and would open up the marque to a whole new line of riders that have no intention of ever throwing a leg over a cruiser.
But then you would be riding an ” American sport tourer wannabe” made by Harley.
Once they put open pipes on it, it will still sound like total crap going through my neighborhood.
Cool, but which of those models listed has standard sitting position, standard peg position, cornering clearance, and decent power to weight ratio? One of them, right?
Sorry Randy. Maybe next year? lol
100 horses isn’t bad and plenty of torque is good. They just have to work on the ergos, cornering clearance and weight thing now
They could lighten the Sportster if they wanted to by dumping that stupid dogbone frame that added 50lbs in 2004, and EB already showed them how to make a ton of power from the 4-cam engine. Some of us keep dreaming of a decent performance Sportster again…
The first thing that crossed my mind when I saw the Milwaukee Eights’ 4 valve heads was whether or not that technology would ever be applied to the Sportster. Sadly, I fear not. My favorite Harley will slog on until it’s eventually replaced by something with a radiator.
If you want a better performaning sportster look at an indian scout. Harley should look long and hard at what Indian is doing. I love there new engine, air cooled 4 valve with counter balance but still divorced trans with a primary chain drive, why? Every one gave it up ages ago. Please HD i love you but time to make a complete package and stop living off your lagacy. This is why you lost my same to Indian.
I owned a 2003 Sportster for several years, liked most of it but in the end too tight ergos for my completely average 5’9″.
Nice looking piece. I hope it does well for them. Happy they went back to a single cam, considering the well documented issues with their twin cam design…plus it gives them a little breathing room from the EPA gestapo. I would be interested to see how well the slight adjustment to the exhaust angle and the lower idle rpm mitigate the heat issues. My 96″er is a real cooker in traffic.
Seems like HD is always claiming innovations to improve performance, but like their previous problems such as the tensioners on the TC motors started to go belly up, the excuses from distributors/techs/dealerships/etc. was always the customers fault. When I read how HD pays attorneys hush money on the lawsuits to hide the problems with not admitting guilt I realize HD is not a reputable Manufacturer. Have ridden and wrenched all HD bikes since the early 70’s and finally got a real bike, a 2015 Roadmaster Indian. Polaris has me as a customer with their sincere backing of their great bikes.
Well said I too went with Indian. An American cruiser with up to date tech but old styling. Only 3 completely new designed air cooled engines in 80 years is sad Briggs and Stratton has designed more air cooled engines then that and some even are v twin with overhead cams. I love HD but so glad Polaris came around with Indian to make Harley greater cause compation breeds better products and now with Indian they finally have direct compition. By the way this new engine seems alot like what Yamaha did with there roadstar engines light years ago. Please HD finish the job and update your chassis they date back to the 80’s. You have the money and talent to develope it just not the will go spend it.
So many babies here and their minds are like full diapers. No way would I try to change them. Besides crap, these manlets are full of themselves.
Having said that I should like to point out to these kiddies that despise HD that if Harleys are so sucky then why pray tell does every Japanese marque copy them so blatantly?
The worst offenders are the drag bikes of Starley and Kawacopy. If you don’t want the genuine item, fine. Ride your knockoff and be happy. Personally I would happily own a Vic or Indian before I ever sat on an Asian atrocity cycle (an homage to the great Highwayman). Those two rides are American. Nothing wrong with Japanese, German, Italian (Guzzis are excellente’!) or what have you. Those that claim to not ride HD because they don’t want to follow the herd are stuck in the back of the pack of a pod of pusillanimous plebes, swearing allegiance to the nose they just cut off to spite their ego.
No one with an IQ above room temperature cares what you feel (not think) about HD. I just realized that this site may not enjoy the truth of my words, much less those of the esteemed Highwayman. If not, then this will either be edited (read: neutered) or not allowed at all. Whatever.
HD looks to have done a good job. Whether or not it’s a great job remains to be seen by rolling up the miles in the real world. They’re back in the running for my money on my next touring rig. Real world torque, comfort, capacity and looks that others copy because their own history, while not unworthy of duplicating (Japanese Scramblers in the late sixties mid 70s were the tits!), does not sell like Harley’s does.
To the site owner, either print the words as they are or delete them and at least be adult enough to email me why.
“No one with an IQ above room temperature cares what you feel (not think) about HD. I just realized that this site may not enjoy the truth of my words, much less those of the esteemed Highwayman.
Ya got me, Highwayman. It’s impossible to argue with pure logic.
Whoa! That’s some fancy name calling. I wish you’d just say what’s on your mind and not beat around the bush.
who or what got this guys panties in a wad?
Funny how WSHART sounds exactly like the morons he is describing in his rant.
Your full of funny nick names for things: Asian atrocity cycle what does that even mean does it apply to my Honda XR 600R the last time I checked the Motor Company didn’t make any thing equivalent let alone something that could keep up with a modern dirt bike.
Half Baked, I’m going to supply the following link:
http://forums.cycleworld.com/showthread.php?t=238581
not to advance the cause of intolerance, rather to give some clarity to WSHart’s references. I will also add a new comment for others who may not dig this deeply into the comments. I don’t know where you reside WSHart but I hope you’re up-to-date on your rabies vaccine.😨
Thank you Motorcycle Daily for the HD news. Been so busy lately, haven’t been keeping up like I should. Love air cooled engines and they’re keeping them alive. With that being said and being an HD and Honda owner both, I just love the comments by all the experts.
Not quite facetious enough Doc. 😉 Please give us your take.
You go Harley. Making better bikes to compete with other great American made bikes. More better bikes=more better choices…should make for more happy riders.
Harley was the first motorcycle company to make a 4 valve motor
You may want to check your history. In the motorcycle world, the 1914 Peugeot Grand Prix racer, 500 cc DOHC 8-valve parallel twin and the 1915 Indian board track racer, 61-cid (1.0-liter) OHV 8-valve V-twin both came ahead of the 1916 Harley 8 valve racer. Now they’re still playing “catch up” to Indian. 😉
I stand corrected. Thanks, I did not know about the other 8 valve twins
Indian first v twin sold to public first 8 valve motor in motorcycle. So sad they failed many years ago but so happy they are back
Harley was the first motorcycle company to build a 4 valve motor
Not even close.
Well, just 2 years after the first 8-valve engine 100 years ago is pretty close don’t ya think?
1st is 1st. Ask Ricky Bobby.
To me, a big part of America’s love affair with HD has to do with the idea that iron “lasts forever”, the dream of finding an old HD in a barn, or leaving one to your grand-kids. Rubber/plastic/silicon parts diminish that dream – and water cooling brings with it more rubber/plastic/silicon parts. But progress is required…not optional.
Wow. Liquid cooled heads. More Harleys with radiators. Blech. Glad they at least kept some of them air cooled! I’m probably not going to buy a Harley anytime soon, but if I did you can bet it would not be liquid cooled!
Right? I mean we can’t let lawn equipment be the only mass produced air cooled ICE’s in America…
Looks good. It looks like HD came to a lot of the same engineering conclusions Yamaha did when they were designing the Road Star/Warrior/Raider motor. I’m skeptical about the zero maintenance on those new heads, even Yamaha has their hydraulic lifted, 4-valve heads on the maintenance schedule. HD makes beautiful bikes but I’m not convinced they value longevity and durability in their engineering choices, particularly after the spring plate in my old Sporster’s clutch came apart.
I don’t blame HD for being slow with technology in their products. Their customer base is holding them back. The V-Rod caused organ rejection, so they have to use gentle exposure-desensitization therapy and trickle the technology in slowly. I expect upside down forks to make it to their Softail range sometime in 2050.
Welcome to 1978 Harley-Davidson.
Still using that Mickey Mouse rubber mounting in the flexo-frames.
Wow – how exciting for Harley. Are we supposed to be excited for these morons. They finally got a clue on how to build an engine. My 1984 Ninja 900 had four valves eons ago and was a real super bike engine. Probably too little too late for Harley as their stock is fading badly.
10 % increase in HP ?
4 Valve head —–is this stuff news ?
Yes. It’s actually very big new. Wake up
It’s big only because H-D is so loathe to change their already incredibly-successful engine platforms. Kind of a relative thing.
Their competitor (Victory) has had 4-valve heads since… well, since the very first Victory rolled off the assembly line. That was in 1998, of course.
Hats off to the engine ears at HD. Polaris going to keep you busy. This new 8valve engine is a great improvment .
It has always been the goal to reduce weight to gain power, speed, control, economy, braking, handling, heat reduction with engine longevity, etc. Removing pounds increases useful power output. It is a free method to gain engine power.
It remains to be seen if switching to a single cam design will resolve the many flaws with the twin cam engine.
At least this one has half the number of chains and tensioners. My money says that S&S will have a gear drive cam set up and cam in short order.
No complaints about more power and less heat, tho I’ll believe that when I ride it.
I hope they went back to an overdrive transmission. No news about that. Of course they never told us that they were taking away the overdrive on the Rushmore bikes. My 2015 turns 4000 RPM @ 85 MPH while my 2009 turns 3200 RPM @ 85 MPH. Right when states are upping the speed limits Harley gave me a running around town bike instead of a touring bike. No 2017 for me unless it is a true overdrive cruiser.
Your 09 can’t get out of it own way. At a 70 roll my Indian freight trained a 110 CVO.
Harley did not have an overdrive. They had a sixth gear they called cruse drive. Harley uses a direct drive transmission meaning top gear will always be a one to one. The lowered rpm at speed is the result of final ratios and over all ratios not an overdrive.
After reading some of the comments I see the US has a lot of the same personality types as Australia has… people that rubbish, complain and always trying to find fault with what their fellow countrymen are trying to achieve. Unfortunately, the whingers and complainers won out and Australia no longer has a motor industry (think about it) despite building some of the best large cars and utility vehicles in the world. Harley Davidson is an iconic US brand that is revered through out the world and it would appear, despite the best efforts of regulators, HD has achieved the impossible by manufacturing a large capacity air-cooled V twin that is able to comply with ever more stringent pollution and noise regulation (without cheating like VW). HD has my admiration and sincere praise for its achievement. Good on ya HD! Well done!
I agree it’s about time they got off their arse
Wuh? Mate, I had no idea that the evil “regulators” were out to hamstring HD. You know something I don’t? The technology choice is that of the manufacturer not the evil “regulators”. I have no idea what you’re talking about. Are there special anti-HD regulations locked away somewhere in some secret EPA compound? And just what is HD trying to accomplish that we “whingers” are trying to stop? Australian auto industry? Were these Aussie autos unfairly regulated out of existence by the “evil Australian regulators”? Were they air cooled, underpowered, technologically-challenged also? Wuh? Volkswagen? Maybe diesel is a good next choice for HD. Why not? People trying to find fault with their fellow countrymen? When did honest, scientific analysis become unfair or mean-spirited? My God man, if you want to sing the praises of HD, good on ya! But please don’t suggest the citizenry and federal regulators are out to destroy poor little HD. They’ve survived and subsequently thrived with the help of the Federal Government. I sure as hell hope you own/ride an HD product. If not, you’d better get one quick. I hear the USA and its “whingers and complainers” are trying to choke HD out of existence. This HD thing has me mystified.
“HD has achieved the impossible by manufacturing a large capacity air-cooled V twin that is able to comply…..” except that the majority of the new engines are liquid cooled!
Have you forgot about Indian and Victory
Hey don’t forget Yamaha. 1854cc air cooled!
Yes, most people have forgotten about Victory.
Yes, most people have forgotten about Victory.
Is that why they have seen a 10 percent increase in sales while most of the industry is down.
Hard for Harley to forget Indian and Victory; they’re chasing them.
And Moto Guzzi for those that like corners. Proudly going broke since 1921!
The motor company keeps on improving. Great news.
Interesting that they went back to a single camshaft.
Half the number of cams, chains, and tensioners. The bean counters like that.
Someones really really scared of Indian…
Oh yea. Indian’s got them thinking. Can’t wait till the ftr750 hits the track
You mean instead of the edge of the stage and the crowd?
Ouch! That’s really mean. But it’s a good one…LOL
It is pretty. Now put that in a 450lb.(wet) street tracker and I’ll shut up.
“Now put that in a 450lb.(wet)… and I’ll shut up.”
Yeah, sure – Harley’s 1800cc engine in a 450 pound bike – ‘guess we’ll be waiting a while (for relief).
Sorry, being a bit sarcastic, KenHoward. Trying my best not to rubbish, complain and be a “whinger” as my friend David from down under classifies those of my persuasion. Then, of course, The Highwayman made his appearance and left no doubt as to why I must work on my xenophobic skills.
p.s. The (for relief) didn’t go over my head. You’re right, I do go on.
I’d like to ride one. The old blockhead was great … smooth and torquey. It will be interesting to see how this one is better. It is not a Hayabusa beater, of course, and those who can’t get over that should just … get over that. It is a different type of motor for a different kind of rider.
Kind of surprising, though, that HD is not migrating to water cooling to overcome tightening emission standards.
the 114 has targeted water cooling, the 107 targeted oil cooling
There is something in old american engineering…. HP… IBM… GE, I think the Whirpool washing machine in my parents house it’s still working… after something like 20+ years… just a filter change.
I don’t know at which point that thing for pushing the envelope… the boldness started to wash away…
I would LOVE to have Ford… or Harley or a 100% american stuff kicks all others companies badWord but that seems like it’s not going to happen…
I don’t remember how I got to this link, I’m not sure if it’s fake but it describes 61 reasons why you shouldn’t buy a HD….. 61… some of them talk about engine destruction….
http://www.jamesrussellpublishing.biz/beforeyoubuyharley.html
Since I just found out above that you don’t have to adjust the clearance on those 8 valves, I’m willing to give this new engine a chance. It might actually be a great cruiser motor! If they’ve addressed the lack of rear suspension on these new bikes I might have to consider a new Roadglide this time.
early rumors had it screw and locknut. Good to see it doesn’t have those.
I would be concerned about relative clearance between the pairs of valves. Harley claims they’re “set for life”, but no two valves/seats/stems are going to wear identically. One valve in the pair needs a means of adjustment to make it’s clearance identical to the other, and the hydraulic lifters will take care of the rest. Time will tell, and if it turns out to be a problem, the aftermarket will offer a fix for it.
They said good for the life of the engine. They don’t expect 100,000 miles anymore. Recent consumers do not keep or ride their Harleys the way owners used too. The engine is no longer built to be sustainable for generations like an Evo with bushings and bearings that can be replaced and honed. Moving parts ride in parent metal and require case or engine replacement instead of bushing, guide or bearing replacement. So yeah the valves will not need service in today’s probable consumer’s ownership of the new engine, after that disposal and replacement will take the place of service and rebuilding.
It’s likely some long service life engines will need the valve ends ground. No big deal. Smaller lighter valves should wear the valve seat at a slower rate anyway.
Welcome to the 21st, er, late 20th Century H-D! Seriously, they should be good engines and extend the big twins lives another decade or so.
Harley riders could care less about technology. The biggest and most important concern on these new motors to them is how will they sound with no exhaust? No loud cool sound then these motors will join the V-Rod as a maybe Harley. Harley can’t give V-Rods away, why? Did you ever hear one with out a muffler. Terrible!!! V-Rods are now girly bikes along with the 883. With these new motors the Harley guys will now have an earth shattering 100 HP to haul around there 1000LB bikes.
Luckily, change is inevitable. Apparently HD did a TON of market research and found that riders are changing. They don’t want a noisy, shaky Harley. A refined throaty sound will still be there. Yes, the old school Harley rider will always be there, but he’s usually not the one buying the new $25k+ bikes. Between CARB, EPA, and EURO4 the days of loud straight-pipe Harleys are coming to and end. They just got a massive EPA fine for the Screamin’ Eagle tuner boxes that will also cost millions more in buybacks and fixes. The old models will still be on the used market if that’s what you think you need, but Project Rushmore was the start of the change and this is the continuation.
“The days of loud straight-pipe Harleys are coming to an end”- I don’t think so. With everybody texting, maybe loud pipes DO save lives. A lady was on CNBC a couple of days ago and said motorcycle deaths are rising at an alarming rate because of cell phones and higher speed limits. A loud bike is annoying, but at least it gets you noticed.
The V Rod engine was misused. If Harley would have packaged the v rod engine the way that Indian did I believe the engine would have flourished and spread to other models. Harley was too extreme in platform design when it came to the v rod as a whole. A very similar engine exists in the new Indian Scout and seems to be doing very well. In my mind Victory, their air cooled twin and now Indian have always been WHAT HARLEY SHOULD HAVE DONE.
The sound problem with the V-Rod has nothing to do with the four valve/DOHC thing.
It’s all about the cylinder angle. Only 45° sounds like 45°. These new engines won’t have that V-Rod problem.
Wow Fred I hate to say this but you sound like a bitter lard-ass with the way you’re putting the Vrods and 883s down. I wonder what these 2 bikes in particular did to you. I’m willing to bet tho you wouldn’t dare walk up to someone owning one of these bikes and express how you feel the way your doing on this site. A coward wouldn’t do that. You just don’t like these bikes we get it. Earth shattering 100 hp? Ha! ha! ha! You call that earth shattering. Maybe to someone use to riding a scooter. Vrods (that which you call a girly wanna be Harley) produces slightly more horsepower and is slightly less heavier than most of the popular Harley cruisers. Vrods are more sportier that your typical cruiser and usually fat boys don’t like them because they would look stupid being on a strong and sporty looking bike while looking fat and out of shape riding it. That’s why you really don’t see many fat guys riding them. Harley Davidson listens to its client base and delivers. This new Milwaukee Eight engine still seems awesome and way more advanced and improved than previous models but with your probably (260+lbs)it doesn’t sound like you’re going to be breaking any speed records with it. Try SLIMFAST. Good luck to you.